Richard Dyer Development of OHS Interview for Sonora's Community Radio Station KAADLP 103.5 FM
Recording opens playing “California Here I Come” by Al Jolson:
“California, here I come
Right back where I started from
Where bowers are flowers bloom in the spring
Each morning at dawning
Birdies sing and everything”
*Music Fades out*
Chris Osward: 0:20 - 0:55 It's time for “Speaking of the Motherlode: A nostalgic look at the history of the Gold Country”, hosted by Shelley and Kris.
Shelley Muniz: These recorded interviews are part of Columbia College Library’s Oral History series. This program is presented by your community Radio KAADLP 103.5 FM Sonora, California streaming live online at KAADP.org.
Chris Osward: Please join us as we experience history through the eyes of those who lived it.
*Music begins again* “California, here I come
Right back where I started from
Where bowers are flowers bloom in the spring…”
Shelley Muniz: This is Shelley Muniz and Kris Osward. We're recording this interview for the Columbia College Oral History Series and Sonora's Community radio station KAADLP 103.5 FM streaming online at KAADLP.org. Today's date is Thursday, October 26th, 2016. We’re at Columbia College library with Professor Emeritus Richard L Dyer in the late 1960s Dick Dyer joined the faculty at Columbia College and organized the college's oral history program. It was one of the first among the state junior colleges. We're thrilled to have Dick with us today and to talk to him about the history of the project. Dick welcome. Let's start with your background. Can you tell us about your parents? And where you grew up, your education?
Richard Dyer: Uh neither my father, nor my mother graduated from high school. And I was the first one to go on in a rather large family not only completing high school and Junior College at Mount San Antonio junior college, but also going on and completing my college work including a master's degree from California State Los Angeles, which by the way at that time was a very good program because they had extremely conscientious professors, including my advisor and enabled us to go through, and work diligently toward Advanced degrees. And it was no Mickey Mouse program because there was about fifteen of us that took the final test and two of us got through
Shelley Muniz: Wow.
Richard Dyer: Although it wasn't Berkeley or Colombia or places like that on the East Coast Columbia. It was a good program. I was pleased to go through with it. But that’s what kindled my interest in local history ‘cause I wrote two papers one on Monterey Park, California, which wasn’t a classic, another where I lived in Monrovia in Southern California, which was a little better, but I'm sure there's not a line of people waiting to check it out from the library. (Shelley and Dick Laughing)
Shelley Muniz: So what brought you here? What brought you to Columbia? And what year was that, that you came?
Richard Dyer: About 1967 the word came out that there was going to be a new Junior College in Northern California, Central, California. And I’d always.expected to work toward a position in a junior college. When I was at Mount San Antonio the first one and all of the family members to go on, I fell in love with the junior college approach. At that time it was more of the younger students but the bonus was that the older students began to filter in and you have this kind of marriage between the young and the old that led to a more..I'd like to say more natural relationship at a four-year school or a two-year school.
Shelley Muniz: So that’s what drew you to the Junior College?
Richard Dyer: My work at Claremont Graduate School was directed toward a position in a junior college, but they weren't hiring a lot of people at that time in Southern California. And so I took a job at Arcadia High School a very good Academic School and it led to... a rather good career there in history. It wasn't a lot in local history, but I had a sabbatical and I in my Finnish born wife and two daughters took off for London and I got in at the University there in London and commuted back and forth from our home now during our vacations we go to her home in Finland and return to the university there and then we took 10 weeks and toured Europe during The Primetime which was spring in Europe and we drove all through southern and central Europe meandering north into Finland where we spent the summer with her family though. It was a dream trip. The Dream trip. We had our two daughters with us [and it was] ideal because we had a VW bus and we purposely had picked the one that had the split front seat. So the passenger seat person could go back in the event there was a problem. We had a 3/4 seat in the center for our smallest child and my mother who would come along to join us on this dream trip sat in the back seat with the larger girl back there and it was just a beautiful, beautiful time.
Shelley Muniz: Sounds like it
Richard Dyer: We reminisce about this and we went for about Shelley Muniz:10 a day.
Shelley Muniz: And what year was this?
Richard Dyer: That was 1965 that we did that.
Shelley Muniz: Oh wow
Richard Dyer:Though at that time the dollar really was a dollar bill so we did quite well with that and then we went up to Finland and re-established contact there and fortunately my wife comes from a highly educated and gifted family and they all spoke English and the neighbors were.... one of her brothers was the neighbor with his family and his kids and our two girls. They learned their first English.
Shelley Muniz: Wow
Richard Dyer: So, a lot of fun though and we still reminisce about it that we have a ton of slides and often wondered what you do with slides. Now people don't use things like that.
Shelley Muniz: Right.
Richard Dyer: We even have a slide projector, which is an antique now, for something you have in that probably in the museum though.
Shelley Muniz: So when you got back then at what point did you get up here to Columbia?
Richard Dyer: Well I returned to Arcadia High School, I had an obligation at least 2 years and just about at the end of that period of time we were going to remodel our modest home in a very nice part of Monrovia in the Foothills not unlike this area up here and literally within days of having the contractor come in to give us some ideas and and an estimate. Within days I got a call from someone here at the college here at Columbia
Shelley Muniz:Oh wow.
Richard Dyer: And they asked if I could come up because I was some one of the finalists. And I had received a letter clearly indicating that they were quite interested. And I know that it was a sincere letter. I used to kid them and say “Oh it wasn't one of your form letters”. Some of them were rather offended because they said “We never sent out form letters” and it suddenly dawned on me, one of my colleagues, also a history teacher and both of us were working with advanced placement students had applied for the position. And he showed me his letter and I looked at that message and thought to myself, “ That's not the kind of letter I got”. *Both Laughing*
Richard Dyer: And he stayed at Arcadia and I came to Columbia in the summer of 1969.
Shelley Muniz:Wow
Richard Dyer:I thought I had come to [unintelligible] Laughing
Shelley Muniz: I’ll bet. and the campus was pretty much completed at that point?
Richard Dyer: No no It was still--
Shelley Muniz:Okay.
Richard Dyer: The area, I don't know what you call it now. I guess it's the Manzanita building.
Shelley Muniz: Manzanita
Richard Dyer:Thats over there because this Library wasn’t here..
Shelley Muniz:Right.
Richard Dyer: The Manzanita building was a lot of concrete down and they were putting up the walls. They had some of the class scattered around and that's where we get to our teaching in sort of pioneer days, but it was amazing the innovativeness of those early people and I'm sure that as you think back you can see some of that, That’s going on here now. This kind of interview for example. We were the first Community College to establish an oral history program.
Shelley Muniz: And so how did that come about, how did that happen?
Richard Dyer: Well because of my interest in the local community and the fact that we were just starting. I thought ‘We really need to do something here to get this on record.” I don't see myself as a writer because I have to anguish too much over words and phrases and that sort of thing, but I thought if we get it down now,someday someone is going to pick it up and they're going to tell the story of those Pioneer Days. It was absolutely incredible to go back and listen to some of those early people. I just listened to one of our secretaries that we interviewed and she just passed away and I think it was in the Idaho Jean Peterson though and it absolutely amazing to think how they were able not only to do the routine things that they did, but also were able to start with the Genesis of a beautiful idea that Dr. Roads had about this Community College on this campus that is so pristine though. Yeah.
Chris Osward: You're listening to “Speaking of the Motherlode”, with Shelley and Kris on Sonora’s community Radio KAADLP 103.5 FM and streaming online at KAADLP.org.
Shelley Muniz:Please stay tuned for more Gold Country history, spoken by the people who lived it.
*Short Guitar Intro*
Shelley Muniz: Is there any special memories about that time that you want to share with us?
Richard Dyer: Well, I remember Don Brady who was the representative from this area and Dr. Dusty Rhodes crawled through the Manzanita and the trees over here to this beautiful little semi-lake that we have here the San Diego Reservoir and it was quite an experience as they worked their way through it. And Don said he thought he could get the property for a couple of dollars from the federal government because it was federal land--
Shelley Muniz: Wow
Richard Dyer: But there was a homesteader that was living right next to where the culinary arts area is now and he had his little cabin out there and so they worked out an arrangement with him.
Shelley Muniz:And his name was?
Richard Dyer: That was Billy Goat Davis.
Shelley Muniz: That’s Right. *Laughing*
Richard Dyer: We have an interview with him. Terry Dietz did an interview with him. Terry was one of my students, a long time, a member of the custodial staff here though, but they told him what they would do is that they would move him over to the place that was called his garden. It's now a tennis court. Move him over to his garden and at that Garden they’d build a new house for him. Well it wasn't really european-style Chalet by any means but that's where Billy Goat used to be and he would go out to the ditch where he had all of his mining equipment out on the ditch and he would show me the gold that he had taken out of the ditch. *Laughing* Maybe we should do some of that now to pay for some of the bills.
Shelley Muniz: That might help. *Laughing*
Richard Dyer: Well but, he uh had Cancerous growths on his face and hands. And so he had some difficulty with the last year's. He loved garlic and he smelled like he was carrying garlic around in his pocket that but Billy Goat was was quite a special person and he was considered to be the naturalist on the campus given the title without any monetary reward, but given the title and and a Billy Goat proved to be quite a friend to many of the students because he'd seen--been wandering around talking to them any of them that would pause long enough, he would capture their attention and have a long chat with them about the early days. But he was [ unintelligible] quite a character though. But Don Brady was a person that deserves a lot of credit though because he was a very powerful member of the Yosemite Community College Board, very influential pharmacist came from a family that eventually acquired a sizeable sum of money and he passed away too early too early in his life. His widow then married into the Wise family and continued growing with a boy, two boys and one girl. Two boys went to school out here.
Shelley Muniz: That would be Millie Wise?
Richard Dyer: Millie Wise. Yeah, Millie Wise. She is deceased and, and one of the boys is deceased now too.The girl Margie lives in the east coast now,
Shelley Muniz: Okay.
Richard Dyer: I think maybe North Carolina, that area.
Shelley Muniz: Its changed a lot out here hasn't it.
Richard Dyer: It has it was a memorable experience to go through the pioneer days.
Shelley Muniz: Yes, and in the sixties as well, right?
Richard Dyer: Yeah, the fall of ‘69 is when I started and we were considered to be as former Navy officer Dusty Rhodes said, “The Plank Holders” Both laughing and then others that came along added to the planks that were down that started it though, it was hard work. I always assumed I would come to an easier job. I didn't lose much money in coming up here which sorta surprised me though, because Arcadia High School paid real well, but the problem was that there were only a few of us teaching many classes. If we're going to be a full fledged Community College in are you had to teach in a variety of fields so I taught only history and all kinds of History. I taught political science and also,.a geography class though, and I'd only had one geography class and maybe two political science classes, but you know, you bite the bullet and go on and as a result, we had overloads here. Virginia Blackburn who was there teaching psychology and sociology and a variety of other courses, a single lady, very brilliant in so many ways had probably 400% kind of load compared to the state average and many of us had an overload and so doctor Dusty Rhodes went to the board said that these people deserve a bonus. And those of us that had an overload received not only our regular pay but this bonus which was modest but it was appreciated.
Shelley Muniz: Mhm.
Richard Dyer: It didn't go over too well in Modesto because they thought they were over-worked with their one or two preparations so….You know when I retired I had five preps five preps but I felt that all the bases should be covered for a people that were being… that were going to be transferred. If they get three preps in Modesto, they...they think they're overworked. *Laughing*
Shelley Muniz: So how many instructors were here at that time, 1969?
Richard Dyer: I really don’t remember, but I have a list, if you don't have that list I make sure that you will get it though
Shelley Muniz: Okay great
Richard Dyer:--because some of these were the Pioneer people and I think I've interviewed almost all of them.
Shelley Muniz: And they were all… everyone was really on board with your oral history program that you wanted to start and they understood the reasons behind that and…
Richard Dyer: I'd like to say yes but I’m not sure... You know? We were so focused on what we were doing, that really, people didn't have a great deal of time to sit down and chat as we're chatting here. And sometimes you were more or less a loner as you went out to do what you felt needed to be done.
Shelley Muniz:So, how did your oral history class get started then? How does that happen?
Richard Dyer: Well I did the first interview with Mac McKibben in 1971 a real jovial old-timer who came from the Midwest and settled in Sonora. I Believe in the 1920s though and had a saloon down there where the legend is today. There was a card room in the back and there was then a saloon out in front of that though, but we became personal friends and it was a good interview though, but he described some of the things that were new to me. Since I’m not a saloon goer but in the back they had the not only the card room, but they had a kind of mezzanine walkway around there so that people could come in and make it look down and see what was going on. And many of the times that you have workers at the Mill or in the mines would go in there. And if they were spending too much money someone from Mac McKibben’s staff would tell them that it's time to go home though, ‘cause they way….they watched over each other. I think a lot more than people do today. No, but they they were real careful not to allow these people who had a decent income, but they didn't want to see all of it go away in cards or or booze there.
Shelley Muniz: Mhm. I remember I think it was 1974 probably that I moved up here and at that point in time you were doing your oral history class and I knew one of your students who went out and did an oral history interview. So, how did you how did you talk to your students and get them excited about this program? And did you have a good reaction from your students about getting involved in this?
Richard Dyer: I really think we were more successful with the older students. That's not entirely true but they were inclined to reminisce a little bit more than the younger students early on it became apparent to me that if you're going to teach another elementary school or High School US history class. Everyone is going to be bored to tears. And so I always felt that it was to our advantage to focus on the local community ya know. Why is it called Soulsbyville? Probably if you ask the people there they don't know that. Or Columbia? Or Sonora? My wife just got a call from someone who spoke to her in Spanish. She said “Oh yeah… in Sonora.”, I think that was the wrong sonora they were talking about though, I think it was the solicitation though. But it was fairly easy to show them how this could lead into the early story for Columbia and for the college, so..
Shelley Muniz: Did they each get to choose who they were going... Was it... Did they…... choose the person that they wanted to interview like in our oral history collection. Most of what we have is from your students who went out and interviewed a specific person. Were they people that they knew? Did they...did they choose who they went in and interviewed. Or did you have a list of people
Richard Dyer: Yes to most of those questions because I always compiled a list of people that we needed to interview
Shelley Muniz: Mhm.
Richard Dyer:And I would interview some of them and if a person was looking for someone it was easy to draw someone from that list though the but in most cases there was a tie a lot of them were local people and they knew these people themselves or they were family members or the landlady in Jamestown though that which was a disaster in an interview the poor student I don't even remember his name now and I doubt if you even have that interview she was this chatty landlady and they always had these beautiful talks about what was going on in early Jamestown and the Cowboys in the miners that were down there so he came in and he said, “Okay”. He turned on this tape recorder and she looked at him. *Laughing* So he’d ask question and she gave him a one word or one sentence answer another question and one word or one sentence answer and pretty soon he was getting more and more frustrated and so eventually he just turned it off in the interview failed and then they went back to talking. I don't remember who it was might have been Andy Andy Andy someone but…
Shelley Muniz: That's a great story.
Richard Dyer: But you know there were a lot of things like that that occured and I didn't have time to listen to the whole interview. Whenever they…. their whole grade depended on that, they first established contact with the individual then they establish some kind of a rough outline of what they wanted to do. And then, that they did the interview and I probably learned more than they did as I was listening to some of the tapes though because that's...the old-timers like to talk like most district teachers.
Shelley Muniz: Did you have a favorite interview, can you remember one that you just thought was outstanding? There were several that I thoroughly enjoyed though. I really enjoy talking to our County historian Carlo do Ferrari and I think that was something like four or five or six hours that we are on tape though. I enjoyed Frank Coleman Frank Coleman was a Mewuk Indian and he was a stagecoach driver. He did a lot of the stunts for Hollywood. But the guy with the white hat and the clean boots would be sitting up on top with the reins. They were fake and Frank would be underneath him with the real reins that these 6 charging horses out there.
Shelley Muniz: Wow.
Richard Dyer:But we were having such a great time over in Jamestown at this place though it and we're talking away just like we're talkin here and I looked down and here and heres all of the tape down there on the dirt.
Shelley Muniz:Oh no! *Laughing*
Richard Dyer: I don't know what happened. But this was in the days that was before we even had the cassettes and it had come off and was down there but Frank loved to talk though and so we did it again. We got it on tape though. There were others though…. one of the unexpected ones. I did in Amador County. There must have been six ladies in the room, and I thought well this...this will be different. It was a disaster, you know, it's hard enough to interview a single person. But you add a second person or third or fourth and they all wanted to talk and so you'll hear all these voices cutting and cutting out. It was I don't know if we even kept a copy of it or not.
Shelley Muniz: I think I think we might know the one you're talking about and I think we did.
Richard Dyer:Oh you did? *Laughing* Alright well Amador County had a lot of interesting stories that the old-timers had to tell us though the mining over there was in some ways even more unique than it is here in this area because they had some of the deep mines there. Uh.... Lots lots of good ones though. I interviewed my mother, but that doesn't count.
Shelley Muniz: I bet it was a good interview though.
Richard Dyer: You know the interesting thing there was that fact that I went back to the tape and listened to it sometime after the interview. When I looked at my wife I said, “You know, Mom is getting pretty old isn't she.” And that comes out sometimes in the tape though.
Shelley Muniz: Yeah. That’s a really interesting point because… for all of us in for everybody who listens to this because to be able to get your parent or your relatives voice on tape and then go back later and listen is... is pretty amazing. So, you know, that's something that that this oral history program has done for... for many people. We've had a lot of people call here and say “Wow I heard that you had the voice of my uncle or my grandfather.” and what a.... what a great gift that is to give.
Richard Dyer: I think it’s important that be pursued as much as possible but the problem is these big universities are not interested..
Shelley Muniz: Right
Richard Dyer:--in the voice. They want to have the... The written copy of the interview, but I've always maintained if you're listening to [ indistinguishable name] who had a nice gravelly voice.
Shelley Muniz: Whispered: Exactly
Richard Dyer: You need to hear that--
Shelley Muniz: --Yes.
Richard Dyer:--though. Cuz that was the part of his character. And people remember him for that style and you can't put in a piece of paper “gravelly voice” it..it doesn't convey the beauty of... of that man. Or...the interesting pauses that happen, when the screen door is opened and grandma is shouting something out to them and the interviewer and interviewee are…. are interrupted because grandma is upset because they're not paying attention to her though. So. Well…
Shelley Muniz: You're listening to “Speaking of the Motherlode”, with Shelley and Kris on Sonora’s community Radio KAADLP 103.5 FM and streaming online at KAADLP.org.
Chris Osward: Please stay tuned for more Gold Country history, spoken by the people who lived it.
Shelley Muniz: One thing that we did hear that we were really curious about we heard that there... that a grant associated with the oral history project funded the Miwok roundhouse here on campus, but do you recall if that happened or how that might have come about?
Richard Dyer: Probably indirectly because we had a...Pat [indistinguishable] Rhodes, Dr. Dusty Rhodes’ wife wrote the grant for a National Endowment for the humanities. And that was written…. 1974-75 that time and was funded for Shelley Muniz:12,000, which is a lot of money in those days though. So a part of it included involving the local Miwok Indian group there. And so we talked to some of the people, we recorded some of the interviews probably more talking than recording though. That's all so it was more connected with the restoration of an Indian encampment there rather than directly related to oral history. Indirectly some of these people became involved we learned which way the door should face where the foot drum should be. What kind of displays go in there.
Shelley Muniz:Well that’s pretty fascinating though.
Richard Dyer:We even had them one person who considered himself to be a medicine man, and he came out and he blessed the site, but he did it on his own. Though..
*Shelley Muniz and Richard Dyer Interrupt One Another*
Richard Dyer: And he was not interviewed..
Shelley Muniz: And do you remember what his name was?
Richard Dyer: Richard Richard Richard… uh... I have it in my files somewhere, but you know, I don't even remember my own name after a few days.
Shelley Muniz: One other thing that we wanted to ask you or another thing was do you feel like there were any fish that got away anyone that you wish you would have interviewed and didn't get the chance?
Richard Dyer:There were a few faculty members that should have been interviewed that I missed out on and off-hand I can't remember which one it was now, but I tried to get to all of the original plank holders over here including administrators some that uh were as far away as El Monte and Southern California. [unintelligible] I went down to Rio Hondo to interview. Dr. Garcia and he had been the superintendent before being transferred down there as their College President, and I'm sure there's a list of people. Because I always felt that so often, the people that are publicized in the books in the newspapers on the air are not the people that are giving you the full story. It’s’ not that they're trying to deceive that's just the fact is with the oral history program to get the miner, the logger, the rancher to speak in his language about how he saw the situation gives you an entirely different dimension--
Shelley Muniz: --Yes.
Richard Dyer:-- not always in conflict, but it tends to flesh out the story. So it's more interesting especially to our young people who don't particularly like history.
Shelley Muniz: And that’s such an important point and actually part of our next question you've touched on this already. But why in your opinion why is it important to continue this project in and what's the point of doing Oral History? You kind of answered that a little bit but do you have anything you want to add to that?
Richard Dyer: Well, I really think that to tell the story you have to have all of the elements that fit into the puzzle. There's a beautiful book that's written about the motherlode from the Huntington Library. I have a..we have a... My wife and I have a very very dear friend has been the part of their program down there for years. So she sent us a copy of this book about the motherlode. And so I looked at the book, no Carlo de Ferrari no Julia Costello. No, Joan Gorsuch. None of the people who lived here and had a more...intimate way of knowing what was going on in the routine of the community none of that and I told her, “You have the academicians and that's great. It's for a good book.” It was nice photographs that they collected and the academic’s approach toward it, but they haven't got down to the common denominator the average person where you know, you're trying to get to you know... not only the good with the bad, you know, the feelings that come out though, and it's always bothered me to think that here because of their reputation, they're going to make um probably a sum of money from the sale of these books and they are maybe 90% or even less of the story of the mother lode. But they've got the credentials they've got the marketing ability. And so these are the ones that are writing the books and I think sometimes our young people sorta see through that and see that maybe they are not getting the full story of what went on during those Glory years.
Shelley Muniz: Mhm. It’s so important. That’s so good. What... what do you envision for Columbia College for our Oral History program at this point to see us go forward? Do you have anything that you'd like to... to have us add or what do you see as our future?
Richard Dyer: I think you folks are on the right track but I’m from the dinosaur age. And you know using the loose reel tape recorders in the cassette tape recorders. It's very cumbersome to do that sort of thing now and time-consuming and up Kris who's sitting here with this interview and you're going to have to say something pretty soon Kris. * Kris Laughing* So we all know you're really here. But Kris is able, you know to dress it up. I cannot believe what technicians with these gifts can do with a simple cassette tape because we make mistakes! The last interview I did was with this beautiful lady, but I had to cough and it sounds like thunder coming out and she's over there. She's feeling a little uneasy and so she has a pad of paper and so she's flipping through the paper what it sounds like the waves of the ocean.
Shelley Muniz: It does.
Richard Dyer: But Kris can handle that though.*Laughing*
Shelley Muniz: We're very fortunate.
Richard Dyer: I have very much enjoyed being able to dress it up a little bit though.
Shelley Muniz: He does... he’s very talented and we're very lucky to have him and he really is enjoying the Oral History Project. So..
Chris Osward: You're listening to “Speaking of the Motherlode”, with Shelley and Kris on Sonora’s community Radio KAADLP 103.5 FM and streaming online at KAADLP.org.
Shelley Muniz: Please stay tuned for more Gold Country history, spoken by the people who lived it.
Shelley Muniz: Do you feel like... is there anybody now that you.... that you would like to see interviewed? Anybody that..that you would recommend to us to speak with?
Richard Dyer: You know that that is a very good question. The problem is it requires a more diligent response than just something from the top of my head--
Shelley Muniz: Mhm.
Richard Dyer:-- because there are still some of these people around they are the hidden people so often but they are people that remember those glorious early years. It hit me all of a sudden Neil Power. The former superintendent of the Columbia State Park.
Shelley Muniz: Great idea.
Richard Dyer: Neil is around and he is knowledgeable about those early years and the park and its relationship with Sacramento.
Shelley Muniz: Mhm.
Richard Dyer: And with people like Geraldine McConnell though and what she was like and Sharon Grout. He would..he would be a good start. He loves Columbia, when he retired, he retired because they were going to transfer him to another position he says “ I'll never leave Columbia.”
Shelley Muniz: Okay and Neil was the actual Park superintendent?
Richard Dyer: Yeah he was.
Shelley Muniz: Okay.
Richard Dyer: Yeah, and another one I bet he gets very very emotional is Bob Diehl. Who was one of the Deans out here at the college and is in assisted living over in the South Bay Area somewhere but Bob was responsible for dressing up the City hotel. When I came in 69 you could walk along the street there and look from the street down into the basement of the City hotel where they have their Wine Cellar today.
Shelley Muniz: Wow.
Richard Dyer: And Bob Diehl got the money from the federal government and permission from Sacramento to do something there and people tend to overlook the fact it was the college who was there. Bender what's what's his first name?
Shelley Muniz: Tom Bender?
Richard Dyer: Tom Bender was there for a long long time and established The Wine Cellar and a lot of the programs though.
Shelley Muniz: Those are some great names and some good ideas for us. If you 50 years from now if someone was listening to this interview, what's something that you would like him or her to know about Dick Dyer?
Richard Dyer: Well, I'm not..I'm not really that interested in a lot of attention. *Shelley Laughing* I come from a very humble family. I married into a very gifted family, and I would like them to think in terms of what took place here in this beautiful environment. I and my wife are going to be celebrating our 60th wedding anniversary in a few months and I've often thought you know, if someone would ask me this kind of a question regarding my family, what would I say? Well one of the things I would say, It was the right people. This is a very very gifted group of people who came up from different parts of the state and decided as Pioneers that they were going to work sometimes too much as individuals, but that was the Hallmark.And they were going to establish a different type of junior college and we called it a junior college in those days. It seems to me a little bit of that dream was lost though. And that's not necessarily bad, but uh..there were many things that were done that were not done in Modesto or another Community College.
Shelley Muniz: Right, Mhm
Richard Dyer:And there were some things that should have not have been done up here. But these things did happen though. The old story was that um... when the guys came up and took the job the first year the wife cried. And after that she got a divorce or she'd adjusted. Now I haven't heard that for a long time, *Both laughing* but that's what used to go around here.
Shelley Muniz: Yeah, yeah.
Richard Dyer: Or the [unintelligible] think of the community services and we always said, you know, if you get a splinter in your finger get the ambulance ready and get me down to Modesto where there are real doctors.*Both Laughing* Well that’s changed.
Shelley Muniz:Yeah.
Richard Dyer: No, I would like to see that there be something about the early days here in this community. Billy Goat Davis was a remarkable person. Not a perfect individual you know, know he loved to go down to Cervantes. Then when he’d drive back, it was a little bit of a problem is whether you could come down that road or not.
Shelley Muniz: And Cervantes was a bar and was where? *Dyer Laughing* Where was is
Richard Dyer: It was on Washington Street in Sonora and all the friends were down there to take a peek in there. Now you can still see that there are dollar bills that are splashed around on the ceiling. *Laughing* And, the community itself has changed quite a bit, but you know, there’s still a lot of that. There's still that... that foundation that made most of us who think about it realize how important that was in our lives. My wife walked the streets of Sonora to get a feel for the community before I signed on the bottom line.
Shelley Muniz: Wow
Richard Dyer: I sat for a little refreshment at Doctor Rose's house in the evening and I kept looking up in the sky and everything seemed to go on and on and on and I often thought of that realized that it was like coming to that mountain, you know when you came to this College here. And we kept going up and up and up but you never quite got to the top. I'd reached a plateau when I was teaching in high school, you know, I did my work and all enjoyed it, good people, good students, but I reached a plateau, but I never reached a plateau here. There's always another challenge. That's um right there. So I realized that it was a special time for a lot of us and it has conditioned us and our families to make us feel that divine intervention. That's what happened and it's now called Columbia College.
Shelley Muniz: Mmm. That’s beautiful. You said a little while ago that you had something really powerful that you wanted to share about all of this.
Richard Dyer: I do and I don't know about how valid it is. My dream in the seventies was to establish a motherload study center here. Not just history, but it would rotate from history to biology to geology. All of these could be there but a motherload study center here at the college and that we would rotate with faculty members... depending on the theme that was going to be offered. At that time I contacted the University of Pacific. With the thought that they would provide the umbrella. And then we would invite in school teachers to come and stay in dormitories that were not yet built but would soon be built in dormitories and they would get their incremental credit so they can go back to their schools for their salary increase but they'd also get instruction by the Columbia Junior College teachers on subjects that would enable them to enhance different phases of their school’s education or their courses there. It was the wrong time. There was no money and what bothered me is that except for Blaine Rogers and Ross Carkeet two Old Timers, or they call us dinosaurs now except for those people and Dusty Rhodes, Pat Herder There wasn't a lot of a support by the the faulty.... though and so after a few meetings which were tape recorded. I don't know they're is still available. After a few meetings, it was a dream that would never be fulfilled though. Now it's different here with the internet. You can do a lot of things like that. At that time, there was no such thing and it would have been a real blessing for teachers who didn't have to go to UOP or Berkeley or UCLA in order to get their extra credit though. But by giving them a credential from University of the Pacific, it would add the luster that they needed. They were going to show their superintendent that they were keeping up with their discipline. It was a... a disappointment, but uh..you know.... I've learned to live with it.
Shelley Muniz: It sounds like a good dream though. Now, it sounds like something that maybe could be talked about again. That would be amazing. Huh? Can I see…
Richard Dyer: I thought so and I think that uh...would have to be revised a little now with the…. with the electronic age that we have. I still dream a little now and then.
Shelley Muniz: That’s a good thing. Dreams are always good. Is there anything else you want to share with us today?
Richard Dyer:I appreciate what's going on in our community. Now, this isn't the first time we've had a radio station that is broadcasting oral history. We had a person that...used excerpts from tapes. And then had his talk show out of KVML. Yeah, it lasted maybe a year or so though, but it's popular with people. I'm surprised how many people respond to it and even some old... our old students. So we have Neil Mill who was one of the interviewers in quite a few of the tapes and he's here at the college working out in the exercise class though looks great. I remember interviewing him for a job as a technician here.
Shelley Muniz: Oh wow.
Richard Dyer:And I think he was just out of the Navy though and he didn't get the job. The other job….that job went to another person but later they discovered there was a little bit more money and so he was hired too and so he's become a real friend of the college for a long time--
Shelley Muniz: That’s good.
Richard Dyer: And went off into other...work in the community.
Shelley Muniz:It's always a great thing when you see your ex students out and about doing well, isn't it?
Richard Dyer: *Laughing* It is…. Yep.
Shelley Muniz: It’s satisfying
Richard Dyer: Yep.... yep it makes you feel something was right. Though and it’s still right too though...It's still a good school, though.And…. I think that's the joy of... of reminiscing with you about it, though.
Shelley Muniz: Well, you've... you've shared some wonderful things and given us some... some new insight into some histories here, and we just thank you so much.
Richard Dyer:Mhmm. Always a pleasure, I like to talk about the old days. *Shelley Laughing* That’s what happens when you become 85 years of age. My memory is not always that good, but I remember an awful lot about oral history because it was... It had a special place.
Shelley Muniz: It did have a special place in your heart.
Richard Dyer: Yeah, and it’s amazing because.... it wasn't planned that way it just happened. But sometimes things evolve and then they... they sort of mushroom out that way, yeah. The history of the college with the professors and we even have interviews with the students in 1968 and some of those will give you a down-to-earth kind of feel about what was like when the snake got out in the library and the librarian and was having a terrible time over there in Old Columbia because he didn't know where the snake was located and why the offices were only large enough for two people. Remember this was the house of prostitution there for a while.
Shelley Muniz:Where the office was in Columbia?
Richard Dyer: Next…..next to the Fallon House there.
Shelley Muniz: Okay right, yeah.
Richard Dyer:And the offices there were real tiny, smaller than this room here and you got room for maybe three or four offices here.
Shelley Muniz: I just... That just made me think of another question because in another taped interview with you that... that I listened to the other day you were talking about the fact that you know that the time itself the sixties and then the there was a protest here on campus because that was going on all over the place at that point in time with the War and Vietnam War and and everything. So tell us a little bit about that. What was the flavor of campus at that time?
Richard Dyer: I didn't know the person who was a veteran who came here but he was very angry. And there was a newsletter that came out and he would write in the newsletter and eventually the newsletter ceased. I think it might have come from President Rhodes though, but it was nasty and horrible looking uh... caricatures that were there too and uh... one day early we would go into the classroom and here was a leaflet and basically the leaflet said “We Protest War in Vietnam information Gap” and a long list of things like that and it was one of those must have been June school went into the June in those days... must have been in June it was one of those hot days and the protesters occupied the island out here and another instructor.... I don't think his name should be mentioned. He happened to have been my colleague by the name of Hamilton... not the Hamilton here... that was here now... but Hamilton felt that we should call the police, get the police out here and get them off that... and fortunately cooler heads prevailed and no one did anything. In fact it was so hot that after a while they took a swim out there in the San Diego Reservoir and disappeared into the hills.
Shelley Muniz: Oh wow.
Richard Dyer: But we did hear though...there was a... person has been planted here by one of the organization's and that uh..Dr. Rhodes was informed as to who he was and what they were going to do. But you know, this was after Santa Barbara after Berkeley and who wants to be concerned about some wayward kids that are occupying an island way out in the Hills.
Shelley Muniz: Great piece of history though right there, you know it really is. Well, thank you so much. It's been so great to have you here today and just spend some time talking to you. We just respect you so much and appreciate everything that you've done here for the college and for the Oral History Program that Kris and I are so fond of so..
Richard Dyer: Well, you're doing a great job and that’s what’s important. We need to fade into the background, those of us who were the plank holders in the early days and we've done as much as we could do and maybe a little bit more than we expected to do but you folks need to pick it up and with your skills and electronics and contacts on your youthful vigor. That'll help keep it going and keep it alive though. That's what's important to many of us, so...
Shelley Muniz: Thank you.
Richard Dyer:Yep, thank you.
Shelley Muniz: So here’s your question, does Columbia College and KAAD Sonora Community Radio have your permission to post, share, publish, and or broadcast all or part of this interview from now until the end of time?
Richard Dyer: Who's going to be here till the end of time is that yours Kris? *Laughing* Indeed, and hopefully it will be uh..publicized many times because there's a real story to be told. Thank you.
Shelley Muniz: Thank you so much.
Chris Osward: We hope you enjoyed this segment of “Speaking of the Motherlode”, with Shelley and Kris on Sonora’s community Radio KAADLP 103.5 FM and streaming online at KAADLP.org. Thanks for tuning in.
END TAPE
Interviewer: Shelley Muniz
Interviewee: Richard Dyer
Name of Tape: Development of Oral History Series
When: October 26, 2016
Transcriber: Calista Fields-Richardson
Transcribed: 12 April 2020